shelmii

Desperate.

92 posts in this topic

I have this desperate need to post some writing no-no's and things that irk me.. I literally have veins popping from my head right now.

I'm gonna do it. Please critique me when I do oh wonderful graduates and heavenly Scholars. ._.

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Sure, go ahead. But people might have differing opinions, and threads about rants tend to generate more negative emotions than positive ones from my experience, so if there are any disagreements do keep them within the thread itself! :)

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Well, a little debating is never a bad thing Tri.

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Sure, go ahead. But people might have differing opinions, and threads about rants tend to generate more negative emotions than positive ones from my experience, so if there are any disagreements do keep them within the thread itself! :)

I understand what you're saying and now I don't feel like making it, but I could always keep my personal opinion out of it. Due to my experience, some people do tend to take it hard when I point something out about their writing that annoys me, but at the same time that was how I learned how to write and eventually became comfortable in my writing.

When people were constantly nice and simply told me that my writing was good, I learned little to nothing, but after reading over critiques who kinda rubbed it in my face with a reasonable explanation, plus AP teachers giving me shitty grades, I changed myself.

I dunno, I'll think about it. I don't want anyone to leave or anything because of me. ._.

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Trust me, no one leaves the site for stupid menial reasons. At least none I've seen.

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I hope not considering I've been the cause of some people leaving in my previous forum... told you I was a bad person. ;; I won't do it again I promise..

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Hey, don't put yourself down. You've probably just been surrounded by assholes. We're awesome.

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No no, go ahead and debate away. I'm just being super paranoid about things, haha.

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I found this really cool quote once, I don't even think I remember it, but it was Hemingway's I dunno.

It must mean something since I still remember it.

This is probably not how it goes though..

"If someone tells you you're wrong, they're almost always right. If someone tells you exactly why you're wrong, they're almost always wrong"

I'll place my bets on me being the part where I'm the 1% that's right. ;;

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Hey, don't put yourself down. You've probably just been surrounded by assholes. We're awesome.

I was around kids who didn't want to be told or hear opinions for that matter. I just wanted to help, but I guess not.

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Intentions aside, approach is an issue. The reason people respond negatively to a conflicting opinion is usually because of how it was put across.

The question here is are you making a thread to gripe about your own personal pet peeves about writing or are you wanting to open the floor for advice and constructive criticism. You have to understand that these are not the same thing.

Your opinion on writing is by no means a standard to which anyone else must live by. Someone should not be changing thebway they write because you find it "annoyong". While you are very welcome to have that opinion and express it, you cant really pass that off as trying to help.

Writing is an incredibly fluid format with lots of exceptions (especially English) so you can only dictate how people write to some degreem. Fundamental teaching about spelling and grammar is important. Its the difference between "I helped my uncle jack off a horse" and "I helped my Uncle Jack off a horse".

However these are agreed rules in order to minimise potential for miscommunication. Your annoyances may or may not include such things, but I guarantee at some point along the line they will be more about personal preference than anything else. Which is fine, great even. Just don't kid people that your trying to help them if that's the case.

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Also that hemingway quote is stupid. Sorry but it just doesn't make any sense at all.

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I have this desperate need to post some writing no-no's and things that irk me.. I literally have veins popping from my head right now.

I'm gonna do it. Please critique me when I do oh wonderful graduates and heavenly Scholars. ._.

 

Just do it, no one's going to bite your head off. Ok, maybe that's not necessarily accurate, but no one's going to hate you, leave, bear a grudge, or even marginally dislike you, and if they do, I'll eat my helmet (only applicable if given occurrence doesn't wear off within a single-digit number of seconds).

 

DG has the right of it - we're awesome.

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I'll bite your head off.

But only because I'm hungry.

Go ahead and post what you think, really. Though I don't quite agree with Hemingway, at least if you take him at face value. I'd trust a specific warning more than a vague one, unless deliverer of said warning is some kind of wizard.

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Basically that quote implies anyone wbo desires to educate another is automatically wrong.

My blunt statements aside your opinions and grumblings are very welcome. We are hard to scare.

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In addition to what some have said already, I would reiterate that you cannot point out someone's faults in their writing as constructive critique, if you open it with the fact that what it is they are doing, is annoying to you. That is no longer a critique of their mistakes, but a personal irritation of what you consider to be a mistake. As for the quote, it's complete nonsense. I've never heard that before and it sounds like the opposite of what Hemingway often stood for, if the quote exists please show it to me and I stand corrected. But, as we're doing Hemingway, let me quote a couple of my favourites:

 

 

"There is nothing to writing. All you do is sit down at a typewriter and bleed."
“As a writer, you should not judge, you should understand.â€

“There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.â€

- Ernest Hemingway

 

 

All three of these quotes point to what he stood for. That writing is more about expressing the story you want to tell, despite your mistakes. That the quality of your writing is dependant on how much of yourself you devote to it, and not necessarily your professional knowledge of the format. That you shouldn't judge at all, but be open. And lastly that in judging, you are being ignoble, so rather than judging another person's writing on what you consider to be their faults - look in a mirror, so that you might better yourself. As the improvement of the self is really the only thing that matters, if you can go to sleep and say, "I was better than yesterday" in whatever it might be, then it's worth it. No one method of writing is right, so definitely express your opinions, but in doing so be aware that just because you might critique the work, doesn't make you right simply because you have found fault. 

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The quote is by Neil Gaiman, btw

 

That leaves me a little disappointed with him, to be honest.

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Haha. Haven't even started critiquing and a debate has already started. I must say I'm just as paranoid as Tri on this though. Some people may appreciate critiques while others may not want them and be offended that they're made public. If it's really going to be constructive criticism, shouldn't it stay between you and the other person? It seems insulting to make a public thread and come in saying "Well Ice always starts her stories out with an action and I think that's just ridiculous because..." But more constrictive to first see if I'm even wanting criticism and then, if I am, to PM me saying "hey, I think you're writing would improve if you started using a variety of methods. " And then I would choose if I wanted to listen or not.

But I do suppose this is just my opinion.i just felt it should be said. Who knows, maybe I've misunderstood something. I did just wake up ^^

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Correct quote is: 

"Remember: when people tell you something’s wrong or doesn’t work for them, they are almost always right. When they tell you exactly what they think is wrong and how to fix it, they are almost always wrong."

 

Basically is means that if someone tells you you are wrong, that is their opinion and it is almost always right 'cause saying someone's opinion is wrong is dumb. But if that person tries to tell you how to fix it, they are wrong for forcing their opinion on you, for forcing you to change something because it doesn't work for them.

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Yeah, that makes more sense. Thank you for fixing that quote, Sean. My faith is renewed in Lord Gaiman.

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Well if all Shelmii wants to do is put up a list of top 10 things one shouldn't do in writing, rather than pointing to specific people, i think it should be okay?

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I think the point is that what you should or shouldn't do in writing, is often subjective, or otherwise personal in nature. I don't think it would hurt or offend anyone to do it as a general things not to do, but I equally don't think it would necessarily be right.

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Whatever she does is okay. This has sparked debate but ultimately the answer is simple. If shelmi wants to grump about personal annoyances, then thats fine. If shelmii wants to provide constructive and educational tips that is also fine. People are just debating whether this is a personal gripe thread or an advice thread. However it is neither since it has turned in to a debate thread.

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